Is infinity mathematically observable?Does Pi contain all possible number combinations?Can an irrational number have a finite number of a certain digit?Unexpected approximations which have led to important mathematical discoveriesAre there smaller orders (cardinalities) of infinity?Average of left and right limits | Signum function, Heaviside step function, and Grandi's seriesWhy are numbers written in descending order?Finding the two planes that contain a given line and form the same angle with two other linesImportance of parameter constraints with function transformationsmathematization of infinityProblems with Cantor's diagonal argument and uncountable infinityWhat method for mentally computing 2-digit multiplication problems, minimizes the amount of mental steps?
Is infinity mathematically observable?
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Is infinity mathematically observable?
Does Pi contain all possible number combinations?Can an irrational number have a finite number of a certain digit?Unexpected approximations which have led to important mathematical discoveriesAre there smaller orders (cardinalities) of infinity?Average of left and right limits | Signum function, Heaviside step function, and Grandi's seriesWhy are numbers written in descending order?Finding the two planes that contain a given line and form the same angle with two other linesImportance of parameter constraints with function transformationsmathematization of infinityProblems with Cantor's diagonal argument and uncountable infinityWhat method for mentally computing 2-digit multiplication problems, minimizes the amount of mental steps?
$begingroup$
I have a little question. In fact, is too short.
Is infinity observable? (Can infinity be observed?)
I would like to explain it by example because the question seems unclear in this way.
A simple example:
$sqrt 2=1,41421356237309504880168872420969\807856967187537694807317667973799073247\846210703885038753432764157273501384623\091229702492483605585073721264412149709\993583141322266592750559275579995050115\278206057147010955997160597027453459686\201472851741864088 cdots$
Is it possible to prove that there is no combination of $left0,0,0right$, $left1,1,1right$ or $left2,2,2right$ in this writing?
By mathematical definition,
Let, $phi_sqrt 2(n)$ is n'th digit function of $sqrt 2.$
Question: Is there an exist such a $ninmathbbZ^+$, then $phi_sqrt 2(n)=0, phi_sqrt 2(n+1)=0, phi_sqrt 2(n+2)=0$ ?
Or other combinations can be equal,
$$phi_sqrt 2(n)=0, phi_sqrt 2(n+1)=1,phi_sqrt 2(n+2)=2, phi_sqrt 2(n+3)=3, phi_sqrt 2(n+4)=4, phi_sqrt 2(n+5)=5$$
Here, $sqrt 2$ is an only simple example. The question is not just
$sqrt 2$.
Generalization of the question is :
For function $phi _alpha (n)$, is it possible to find any integer sequence ? where $alpha$ is an any irrational number or constant ($e,picdots$ and etc).
I "think" , the answer is undecidability. Because, we can not observe infinity. Of course, I dont know the correct answer.
Sorry about the grammar and translation errors in my English.
Thank you very much.
algebra-precalculus soft-question math-history infinity irrational-numbers
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
I have a little question. In fact, is too short.
Is infinity observable? (Can infinity be observed?)
I would like to explain it by example because the question seems unclear in this way.
A simple example:
$sqrt 2=1,41421356237309504880168872420969\807856967187537694807317667973799073247\846210703885038753432764157273501384623\091229702492483605585073721264412149709\993583141322266592750559275579995050115\278206057147010955997160597027453459686\201472851741864088 cdots$
Is it possible to prove that there is no combination of $left0,0,0right$, $left1,1,1right$ or $left2,2,2right$ in this writing?
By mathematical definition,
Let, $phi_sqrt 2(n)$ is n'th digit function of $sqrt 2.$
Question: Is there an exist such a $ninmathbbZ^+$, then $phi_sqrt 2(n)=0, phi_sqrt 2(n+1)=0, phi_sqrt 2(n+2)=0$ ?
Or other combinations can be equal,
$$phi_sqrt 2(n)=0, phi_sqrt 2(n+1)=1,phi_sqrt 2(n+2)=2, phi_sqrt 2(n+3)=3, phi_sqrt 2(n+4)=4, phi_sqrt 2(n+5)=5$$
Here, $sqrt 2$ is an only simple example. The question is not just
$sqrt 2$.
Generalization of the question is :
For function $phi _alpha (n)$, is it possible to find any integer sequence ? where $alpha$ is an any irrational number or constant ($e,picdots$ and etc).
I "think" , the answer is undecidability. Because, we can not observe infinity. Of course, I dont know the correct answer.
Sorry about the grammar and translation errors in my English.
Thank you very much.
algebra-precalculus soft-question math-history infinity irrational-numbers
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
I have a little question. In fact, is too short.
Is infinity observable? (Can infinity be observed?)
I would like to explain it by example because the question seems unclear in this way.
A simple example:
$sqrt 2=1,41421356237309504880168872420969\807856967187537694807317667973799073247\846210703885038753432764157273501384623\091229702492483605585073721264412149709\993583141322266592750559275579995050115\278206057147010955997160597027453459686\201472851741864088 cdots$
Is it possible to prove that there is no combination of $left0,0,0right$, $left1,1,1right$ or $left2,2,2right$ in this writing?
By mathematical definition,
Let, $phi_sqrt 2(n)$ is n'th digit function of $sqrt 2.$
Question: Is there an exist such a $ninmathbbZ^+$, then $phi_sqrt 2(n)=0, phi_sqrt 2(n+1)=0, phi_sqrt 2(n+2)=0$ ?
Or other combinations can be equal,
$$phi_sqrt 2(n)=0, phi_sqrt 2(n+1)=1,phi_sqrt 2(n+2)=2, phi_sqrt 2(n+3)=3, phi_sqrt 2(n+4)=4, phi_sqrt 2(n+5)=5$$
Here, $sqrt 2$ is an only simple example. The question is not just
$sqrt 2$.
Generalization of the question is :
For function $phi _alpha (n)$, is it possible to find any integer sequence ? where $alpha$ is an any irrational number or constant ($e,picdots$ and etc).
I "think" , the answer is undecidability. Because, we can not observe infinity. Of course, I dont know the correct answer.
Sorry about the grammar and translation errors in my English.
Thank you very much.
algebra-precalculus soft-question math-history infinity irrational-numbers
$endgroup$
I have a little question. In fact, is too short.
Is infinity observable? (Can infinity be observed?)
I would like to explain it by example because the question seems unclear in this way.
A simple example:
$sqrt 2=1,41421356237309504880168872420969\807856967187537694807317667973799073247\846210703885038753432764157273501384623\091229702492483605585073721264412149709\993583141322266592750559275579995050115\278206057147010955997160597027453459686\201472851741864088 cdots$
Is it possible to prove that there is no combination of $left0,0,0right$, $left1,1,1right$ or $left2,2,2right$ in this writing?
By mathematical definition,
Let, $phi_sqrt 2(n)$ is n'th digit function of $sqrt 2.$
Question: Is there an exist such a $ninmathbbZ^+$, then $phi_sqrt 2(n)=0, phi_sqrt 2(n+1)=0, phi_sqrt 2(n+2)=0$ ?
Or other combinations can be equal,
$$phi_sqrt 2(n)=0, phi_sqrt 2(n+1)=1,phi_sqrt 2(n+2)=2, phi_sqrt 2(n+3)=3, phi_sqrt 2(n+4)=4, phi_sqrt 2(n+5)=5$$
Here, $sqrt 2$ is an only simple example. The question is not just
$sqrt 2$.
Generalization of the question is :
For function $phi _alpha (n)$, is it possible to find any integer sequence ? where $alpha$ is an any irrational number or constant ($e,picdots$ and etc).
I "think" , the answer is undecidability. Because, we can not observe infinity. Of course, I dont know the correct answer.
Sorry about the grammar and translation errors in my English.
Thank you very much.
algebra-precalculus soft-question math-history infinity irrational-numbers
algebra-precalculus soft-question math-history infinity irrational-numbers
edited 8 mins ago
Student
asked 40 mins ago
StudentStudent
6491418
6491418
add a comment |
add a comment |
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
Not sure why you multiplied it by $10$, but you can check $sqrt2$ written up to $1$ million digits for example here: https://apod.nasa.gov/htmltest/gifcity/sqrt2.1mil . Full text search shows there are 899 occurences of $000$, 859 occurences of $111$ and 919 occurences of $222$. And that is "just" first one million of digits, that does not even come close to infinity...
Actually, there is possibility that $sqrt2$ is something called a normal number. If it is, it would mean it contains every finite combination of digits you can imagine. Unfortunately, it is currently unknown where it has this property. So in your second case, $012345$ would be there as well (although it already appears once in the first million digits referred above).
Also, there is one popular question here on MSE about whether $pi$ has this property, you might wan to check it out: Does Pi contain all possible number combinations? .
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Well, for $e$ is it possible?
$endgroup$
– Student
18 mins ago
$begingroup$
$e$ is not known to be normal, but (as pointed out in my pseudoanswer) it's conjectured to be. Pretty much all of the normal numbers aside from a few specific constants we know of were specifically constructed for the purpose of showing normal numbers exist.
$endgroup$
– Eevee Trainer
16 mins ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Less an answer than an extended comment:
This actually ties in quite nicely with the concept of a "normal" number. A number which is "normal" is one whose decimal expansion has any sequence of digits occurring equally as often as any other sequence, regardless of the base the number is in.
Of course, it is necessary for the number to be irrational for this to be achieved. "Almost every" real number is a normal number, in the sense that they have Lesbague measure $1$. Despite this, very few numbers are known to be normal, and most of those that are were artificially constructed for the purpose of showing them to be normal. For example, one such number is the concatenation of all the naturals in base $10$, which is known as Champernowne's constant:
$$0.12345678910111213141516171819202122232425...$$
It is suspected that many famous irrational constants - such as $e$, $pi$, and $sqrt 2$ - are indeed normal numbers. Thus, not only would these digit sequences you propose be in the expansion of $sqrt 2$, but every digit sequence would occur in every base - and equally often at that.
Of course, the proof for even $sqrt 2$ seems to elude us at this time. But I imagine that this is not conjectured without basis. As noted in Sil's answer, the three sequences you propose occur several times in just the first million digits. (I anecdotally played around and noticed the first few digits of $pi$ - $31415$ - occurred only once and no later sequences. But again, that's a finite truncation at like one million digits.)
$endgroup$
add a comment |
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2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
Not sure why you multiplied it by $10$, but you can check $sqrt2$ written up to $1$ million digits for example here: https://apod.nasa.gov/htmltest/gifcity/sqrt2.1mil . Full text search shows there are 899 occurences of $000$, 859 occurences of $111$ and 919 occurences of $222$. And that is "just" first one million of digits, that does not even come close to infinity...
Actually, there is possibility that $sqrt2$ is something called a normal number. If it is, it would mean it contains every finite combination of digits you can imagine. Unfortunately, it is currently unknown where it has this property. So in your second case, $012345$ would be there as well (although it already appears once in the first million digits referred above).
Also, there is one popular question here on MSE about whether $pi$ has this property, you might wan to check it out: Does Pi contain all possible number combinations? .
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Well, for $e$ is it possible?
$endgroup$
– Student
18 mins ago
$begingroup$
$e$ is not known to be normal, but (as pointed out in my pseudoanswer) it's conjectured to be. Pretty much all of the normal numbers aside from a few specific constants we know of were specifically constructed for the purpose of showing normal numbers exist.
$endgroup$
– Eevee Trainer
16 mins ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Not sure why you multiplied it by $10$, but you can check $sqrt2$ written up to $1$ million digits for example here: https://apod.nasa.gov/htmltest/gifcity/sqrt2.1mil . Full text search shows there are 899 occurences of $000$, 859 occurences of $111$ and 919 occurences of $222$. And that is "just" first one million of digits, that does not even come close to infinity...
Actually, there is possibility that $sqrt2$ is something called a normal number. If it is, it would mean it contains every finite combination of digits you can imagine. Unfortunately, it is currently unknown where it has this property. So in your second case, $012345$ would be there as well (although it already appears once in the first million digits referred above).
Also, there is one popular question here on MSE about whether $pi$ has this property, you might wan to check it out: Does Pi contain all possible number combinations? .
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Well, for $e$ is it possible?
$endgroup$
– Student
18 mins ago
$begingroup$
$e$ is not known to be normal, but (as pointed out in my pseudoanswer) it's conjectured to be. Pretty much all of the normal numbers aside from a few specific constants we know of were specifically constructed for the purpose of showing normal numbers exist.
$endgroup$
– Eevee Trainer
16 mins ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Not sure why you multiplied it by $10$, but you can check $sqrt2$ written up to $1$ million digits for example here: https://apod.nasa.gov/htmltest/gifcity/sqrt2.1mil . Full text search shows there are 899 occurences of $000$, 859 occurences of $111$ and 919 occurences of $222$. And that is "just" first one million of digits, that does not even come close to infinity...
Actually, there is possibility that $sqrt2$ is something called a normal number. If it is, it would mean it contains every finite combination of digits you can imagine. Unfortunately, it is currently unknown where it has this property. So in your second case, $012345$ would be there as well (although it already appears once in the first million digits referred above).
Also, there is one popular question here on MSE about whether $pi$ has this property, you might wan to check it out: Does Pi contain all possible number combinations? .
$endgroup$
Not sure why you multiplied it by $10$, but you can check $sqrt2$ written up to $1$ million digits for example here: https://apod.nasa.gov/htmltest/gifcity/sqrt2.1mil . Full text search shows there are 899 occurences of $000$, 859 occurences of $111$ and 919 occurences of $222$. And that is "just" first one million of digits, that does not even come close to infinity...
Actually, there is possibility that $sqrt2$ is something called a normal number. If it is, it would mean it contains every finite combination of digits you can imagine. Unfortunately, it is currently unknown where it has this property. So in your second case, $012345$ would be there as well (although it already appears once in the first million digits referred above).
Also, there is one popular question here on MSE about whether $pi$ has this property, you might wan to check it out: Does Pi contain all possible number combinations? .
edited 13 mins ago
answered 35 mins ago
SilSil
5,38521644
5,38521644
$begingroup$
Well, for $e$ is it possible?
$endgroup$
– Student
18 mins ago
$begingroup$
$e$ is not known to be normal, but (as pointed out in my pseudoanswer) it's conjectured to be. Pretty much all of the normal numbers aside from a few specific constants we know of were specifically constructed for the purpose of showing normal numbers exist.
$endgroup$
– Eevee Trainer
16 mins ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Well, for $e$ is it possible?
$endgroup$
– Student
18 mins ago
$begingroup$
$e$ is not known to be normal, but (as pointed out in my pseudoanswer) it's conjectured to be. Pretty much all of the normal numbers aside from a few specific constants we know of were specifically constructed for the purpose of showing normal numbers exist.
$endgroup$
– Eevee Trainer
16 mins ago
$begingroup$
Well, for $e$ is it possible?
$endgroup$
– Student
18 mins ago
$begingroup$
Well, for $e$ is it possible?
$endgroup$
– Student
18 mins ago
$begingroup$
$e$ is not known to be normal, but (as pointed out in my pseudoanswer) it's conjectured to be. Pretty much all of the normal numbers aside from a few specific constants we know of were specifically constructed for the purpose of showing normal numbers exist.
$endgroup$
– Eevee Trainer
16 mins ago
$begingroup$
$e$ is not known to be normal, but (as pointed out in my pseudoanswer) it's conjectured to be. Pretty much all of the normal numbers aside from a few specific constants we know of were specifically constructed for the purpose of showing normal numbers exist.
$endgroup$
– Eevee Trainer
16 mins ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Less an answer than an extended comment:
This actually ties in quite nicely with the concept of a "normal" number. A number which is "normal" is one whose decimal expansion has any sequence of digits occurring equally as often as any other sequence, regardless of the base the number is in.
Of course, it is necessary for the number to be irrational for this to be achieved. "Almost every" real number is a normal number, in the sense that they have Lesbague measure $1$. Despite this, very few numbers are known to be normal, and most of those that are were artificially constructed for the purpose of showing them to be normal. For example, one such number is the concatenation of all the naturals in base $10$, which is known as Champernowne's constant:
$$0.12345678910111213141516171819202122232425...$$
It is suspected that many famous irrational constants - such as $e$, $pi$, and $sqrt 2$ - are indeed normal numbers. Thus, not only would these digit sequences you propose be in the expansion of $sqrt 2$, but every digit sequence would occur in every base - and equally often at that.
Of course, the proof for even $sqrt 2$ seems to elude us at this time. But I imagine that this is not conjectured without basis. As noted in Sil's answer, the three sequences you propose occur several times in just the first million digits. (I anecdotally played around and noticed the first few digits of $pi$ - $31415$ - occurred only once and no later sequences. But again, that's a finite truncation at like one million digits.)
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Less an answer than an extended comment:
This actually ties in quite nicely with the concept of a "normal" number. A number which is "normal" is one whose decimal expansion has any sequence of digits occurring equally as often as any other sequence, regardless of the base the number is in.
Of course, it is necessary for the number to be irrational for this to be achieved. "Almost every" real number is a normal number, in the sense that they have Lesbague measure $1$. Despite this, very few numbers are known to be normal, and most of those that are were artificially constructed for the purpose of showing them to be normal. For example, one such number is the concatenation of all the naturals in base $10$, which is known as Champernowne's constant:
$$0.12345678910111213141516171819202122232425...$$
It is suspected that many famous irrational constants - such as $e$, $pi$, and $sqrt 2$ - are indeed normal numbers. Thus, not only would these digit sequences you propose be in the expansion of $sqrt 2$, but every digit sequence would occur in every base - and equally often at that.
Of course, the proof for even $sqrt 2$ seems to elude us at this time. But I imagine that this is not conjectured without basis. As noted in Sil's answer, the three sequences you propose occur several times in just the first million digits. (I anecdotally played around and noticed the first few digits of $pi$ - $31415$ - occurred only once and no later sequences. But again, that's a finite truncation at like one million digits.)
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Less an answer than an extended comment:
This actually ties in quite nicely with the concept of a "normal" number. A number which is "normal" is one whose decimal expansion has any sequence of digits occurring equally as often as any other sequence, regardless of the base the number is in.
Of course, it is necessary for the number to be irrational for this to be achieved. "Almost every" real number is a normal number, in the sense that they have Lesbague measure $1$. Despite this, very few numbers are known to be normal, and most of those that are were artificially constructed for the purpose of showing them to be normal. For example, one such number is the concatenation of all the naturals in base $10$, which is known as Champernowne's constant:
$$0.12345678910111213141516171819202122232425...$$
It is suspected that many famous irrational constants - such as $e$, $pi$, and $sqrt 2$ - are indeed normal numbers. Thus, not only would these digit sequences you propose be in the expansion of $sqrt 2$, but every digit sequence would occur in every base - and equally often at that.
Of course, the proof for even $sqrt 2$ seems to elude us at this time. But I imagine that this is not conjectured without basis. As noted in Sil's answer, the three sequences you propose occur several times in just the first million digits. (I anecdotally played around and noticed the first few digits of $pi$ - $31415$ - occurred only once and no later sequences. But again, that's a finite truncation at like one million digits.)
$endgroup$
Less an answer than an extended comment:
This actually ties in quite nicely with the concept of a "normal" number. A number which is "normal" is one whose decimal expansion has any sequence of digits occurring equally as often as any other sequence, regardless of the base the number is in.
Of course, it is necessary for the number to be irrational for this to be achieved. "Almost every" real number is a normal number, in the sense that they have Lesbague measure $1$. Despite this, very few numbers are known to be normal, and most of those that are were artificially constructed for the purpose of showing them to be normal. For example, one such number is the concatenation of all the naturals in base $10$, which is known as Champernowne's constant:
$$0.12345678910111213141516171819202122232425...$$
It is suspected that many famous irrational constants - such as $e$, $pi$, and $sqrt 2$ - are indeed normal numbers. Thus, not only would these digit sequences you propose be in the expansion of $sqrt 2$, but every digit sequence would occur in every base - and equally often at that.
Of course, the proof for even $sqrt 2$ seems to elude us at this time. But I imagine that this is not conjectured without basis. As noted in Sil's answer, the three sequences you propose occur several times in just the first million digits. (I anecdotally played around and noticed the first few digits of $pi$ - $31415$ - occurred only once and no later sequences. But again, that's a finite truncation at like one million digits.)
answered 17 mins ago
Eevee TrainerEevee Trainer
8,45821439
8,45821439
add a comment |
add a comment |
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